Friday, July 19, 2013
MMA Rankings are pathetic
This has been something that has bothered me for a long time. As many MMA fans know, most MMA websites have Top 10 & even have an "other contenders" list with 5 extra fighters. However, these rankings are clearly garbage as they're ridiculously biased towards UFC fighters and almost ignore other fighters. Sure UFC is the #1 promotion in the world but that doesn't mean they're fighters are the only good ones or relevant.
I looked at Sherdog's recently and as the title says it's pathetic. I can understand Heavyweight being wall to wall UFC since no other promotion has the depth the UFC has. However after the Bellator Summer Series tournament, the winner should be put on the list. Both Vitaly Minakov and Ryan Martinez have been impressive the past few months.
Then I look at the Light Heavyweight and it's a joke. How are Phil Davis & Ryan Bader on the list? As of writing, Davis has only beaten Wagner Prado and Vinny Magalhaes in the past year. Bader's only notable win was over an overweight Rampage Jackson. His recent win was over an unranked Vladimir Matyushenko who was coming off a 13 month layoff. Why isn't Emanuel Newton a top 10? Sure he's an other contender (top 15) but he should be in the top 10. He's won three fights this year, scored an impressive win over King Mo Lawal, and won the Bellator Season Eight Light Heavyweight Tournament yet he's not a top 10? What about Attila Vegh? He won last year's Summer Series tournament and the Light Heavyweight Title this year. They achieved more in the past year than Phil Davis and Ryan Bader.
The lightweight rankings doesn't have Shinya Aoki in the top 10 who only lost one fight in 3 years to Eddie Alverez. In the last 3 years, Aoki has gone 10-1 with wins over Tatusya Kawajiri, Marcus Auriello, Satoru Kitaoka, and Kotetsu Boku. He successfully defended the DREAM Lightweight Title twice and won the ONE FC Lightweight Title. Pat Healy and Donald Cerrone are very good fighters but I don't think they should be higher then Aoki.
The featherweight rankings are just as bad as Light Heavyweight. Frankie Edgar is ranked at #5 despite being 1-1 at featherweight and defeating an unranked opponent. Cub Swanson beat #7 Dennis Siver and now he's #4? Meanwhile, one of the best featherweights in the world Pat Curran has dropped from #2 to #6 despite being on a 6 fight win streak with wins over Marlon Sandro, Joe Warren, Patricio Freire, and Shahbulat Shamhalaev. He's the current Bellator Featherweight Champion and a tournament winner. Also, Frodo Khasbulaev isn't on the list despite winning a Bellator Tournament and having won 5 straight fights in Bellator.
Then there's the Bantamweight rankings. Masakatsu Ueda is on a 3 fight win streak and just won the ONE FC Bantamweight Grand Prix but not on the list.
Now I'm not trashing these fighters but it seems to me that some are on the top 10 lists simply because they fight in the UFC. Meanwhile, guys who win titles, tournaments, have just as much if not a busier schedule, and have beat at least one good or one name fighter aren't on because they don't compete in the UFC.
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Dude, Sherdog has had Fedor at P4P #1 and HW #1 literally for YEARS until he lost. Aoki was #2 on most people's LW list, and even #1 on some, for many years as well. Eddie Alvarez has been put high on lists, as Chandler has a good spot now.
ReplyDeleteThe truth is you've gotta erase this whole idea of 'he won such-and-such title and such-and-such tournament'... those things don't matter. It's who you beat, period. Titles are nice and all, but what do they actually mean? If you beat Dan Henderson, you beat Dan Henderson, for example. You don't get extra points if he happened to have a title at the time.
Also, you can't just say a guy "should be on the list". There can only be ten guys, after all. Who has fighter x beaten that he should take fighter y's spot? Again, that's all that matters.
You want Minokav on the list and you think he's been unfairly treated due to 'bias'? Really? His best win is fucking RON SPARKS, and the number 10 and number 9 guys on the current list (speaking for Sherdog as our primary example) are Barnett and Miocic. Either of those two below Minakov, let alone Martinez, is laughable!
If you want them as a contender, well, if they win the title I bet they will be. Travis Browne, Gabriel Gonzaga, Mark Hunt, Roy Nelson, and Stefan Struve all have more claim to being near the top 10 than either of those guys. I'm sure one of them (Minakov, I'm betting) will be on there soon, after all.
Atilla Veigh shouldn't be on the list. You list all these things he's done and yet you don't mention what he did in reality - he beat Christian M'Pumbu. That's it. Yes, he got a title with it. Again though, he beat M'Pumbu. No, he shouldn't be in the top 10.
I wouldn't have any beef with putting Emanuel Newton in the top 10, at number 10, but even that is a stretch. Yes, he beat King Mo, a great win for sure. That's it, though. Bader did beat an over the hill Rampage, but he still beat Rampage. I'll call this one a bust and we'll see what happens later - but King Mo's biggest win is Gegard Mousasi, who is a current contender. You always like this idea of moving up, Mortal Kombat style, and passing a guy. Well, he's a contender and Mo isn't. He passed him.
Phil Davis may not have done anything particularly great lately, but the sum of his victories is still higher. The fact is, he fights higher level competition fight in, fight out. You think of Matyushenko as a low level guy, but he could beat a good amount of the guys in any given LHW Bellator tournament. He's a damn good fighter and an experienced one, too. That's a quality win and Davis has a few that buoy him. Remember, he used to be higher up the list.
LW in the UFC is, more than any other division in the world, the most stacked. You fight killers fight in, fight out. Yes, Cerrone and Healy should be above Aoki! He beat Marcus Aurelio? So what? And remember, I love Aoki so it's not like I'd hate it if he was in the top 10 - that'd kick ass. The only way you can argue for him is if you completely discount his last two wins - one which was taken away from him and the other which was controversial.
The FW divisional rankings due seem to be messy and I'll e-mail some of the guys about that. I'm very curious. I do believe some momentum should be maintained when a guy moves divisions, though.
PART 2
ReplyDeleteNow you're passionate and I'm not saying that none of your points are valid. I see them. The problem is that most of the competition in other orgs just isn't there - when a fighter beats another fighter, look at who the losing fighter has recently beaten and ask yourself how much weight this win really has? The Japanese scene is weak - we know this.
You also need to look past a guy winning this and that title and this and that tournament. It only matters who they beat and to a much lesser extent how they beat them (this is more for really, really close fighters in the rankings).
Hell, even the Sherdog guys admit that below the top four or so it's mostly a crapshoot and they aren't a big fan of rankings - they do them because of fan demand.
Again, I see the validity in some of the things you said - but in the end, I don't see anything making their rankings "garbage". I think there are some ranking errors, but none so egregious as to make the rankings some kind of a joke.
Attila Veigh in any top ten? Now THAT'D be garbage.
I think you let things like this bother you too much - you probably spend too much time on forums. That said, I'd be very curious to see what a Ryan Porzl Experience rankings would be like - and I don't mean that sarcastically. You could put your own parameters on it and rank it as you wish. That'd probably be a lot of fun.
Don't take this in the wrong way. Just spirited debate - the best kind!
Well written nonetheless. Thanks for the read!